Stand alone “room in a room” studio build ORANGE NSW Australia

#46

endorka wrote:Source of the post I've no idea if you could get away with it unfortunately As well as other unknowns, I would be concerned about these joins creaking as the material expanded and contracted with temperature changes.

Hi Jennifer

Thanks for looking in and posting

Your point on movement is good - I suspect it is safer to zip off the joins back to flat and use sealant in a 1/4" gap between sheets as you might for OSB, MDF, drywall.

On panel alignment - while I haven't detailed it, all my sheathing will be staggered so as to cover joins and I'll be leaving a 1/4" gap around edges for backer rod/sealant

Andrew

#47

Hi everyone

Long time since I've posted - just been busy building the non acoustic - but critical parts of the shed...cladding, gutters, barge flashing, drainage etc etc

I am now turning my mind back to the central point of this build

In doing so I have one fairly simple question on framing which has become pivotal.

My outer room wall structure is a mix of "normal" and "inside out". It is normal where the outer wall is part of the external structure but I want the internal wall that divides my studio from my workshop to be inside out - simply because it maximises use of space. That makes for an slightly unusual corner structure where the normal meets the inside out. I'm just wanting to get some input on my approach to the join.

As a reminder, the floor plan is set out below - I've left out the framing around the inside rooms to focus on the outer walls. The bottom LH corner is the subject of images below.

My preferred approach is as follows:

I believe it supports isolation consistent with the rest of the leaves - relying on the quality of my caulking and product

The alternative is to employ the zig-zag approach that appears in the reference area of the John Sayers site - as follows:

It is a bit more fiddly to execute and means I have to complete the side wall before framing the dividing wall.

QUESTION - is my preferred approach sound?

Andrew

#48

...or the best of both worlds...

#49

the dividing wall frame should connect to the exterior wall frame, not via a layer of drywall. then the exterior wall drywall has both layers meet up with the nailer on the junction of dividing and exterior wall. if the red are some open metal posts, then you can wrap the dividing wall end post with drywall if necessary to seal it.

#50

Glenn
Thanks - yes as I look at it this post again having the drywall in between the framing sections is a bit dumb :oops:

As it turns out that layer at the intersection will actually be plywood (rather than drywall) as my engineer wants periodic bracing of the external framing and one of the bracing panels falls at the junction with the dividing wall. So my proposal wouldn't be quite as bad as if it was drywall but it still makes more sense to be directly joining the frames.
BTW - these posts are timber.
Andrew

#51

Hi Everyone

Short post - just wanting to gather thoughts on a change I'm considering to my design
I'm thinking about "losing" the door that runs between my CR and my shed area and replacing that with a door that runs between the CR and LR
The new door would be back far enough so its off the early reflection line but not so far back as to get in the way of rear wall treatment.

All I can see is upside
- it gets rid of having to work around the current door placement for rear wall treatment in the CR
- makes it easier to move between rooms; and
- may allow me to do a lower iso rated door than I'd need if I was running with the current design - maybe a single door rather than 2 doors as currently planned as I don't need the same isolation as I do to the outside world

Of course it means I have to access the CR via the LR but that doesn't worry me
What am I missing here? :?:

Andrew

#52

lower rated doors if the two doors left as-is the big space outside the rooms provides a staging area and sound attenuation (think air gap). if you have the CR-LR door it will need to be doubled or much higher rated.

you won't disrupt LR activities going in and out of the CR - so if folks are rehearsing or writing in the LR or need some quiet away from the mix and other activities, you won't be opening the door and causing a concentration loss to their process (or yours in a reverse situation).

as a general guide, i prefer the CR and LR to have separate doors and only a window between them. unless the travel distance is very high to get from one or the other. in which case i'd create an airlock/iso booth to allow that passage. if it's purely your own solely personal studio then whatever works really...

#53

Super helpful Glenn
Looks like that idea just died a thousand deaths!!! :oops:

Andrew

#54

oh and BTW - I will be putting in a window

#55

Hi everyone
Just doing the door hardware order
My doors will be just under 80kgs - the live room doors will be 920mm wide and the control room 820mm wide. I'll need 6 heavy duty hinges on each.
My question is - "what constitutes a heavy duty hinge?...3mm thick material?
Andrew

#56

In the UK they have a rating based on weight of the door and expected use, which generally boils down to how often it will be opened and closed. I've never looked at the hinge material per se, other than to match it to surrounding decor. Perhaps there is something similar in Aus?

E.g 'Grade 13 door hinges comply with BS EN 1935, been tested to 200,000 cycles and can hold interior doors that weigh up to 120kg. These hinges have been fire-tested for an hour on timber doors.'

#57

there are a variety of weight-size hinges though - so sometimes its desirable to go with lower rated and more hinges as means of keep the door edge straight(er)-to-seals, or cost (the heavy duty ones can run $300 or more each vs $40-50 for lighter ones).

beside the hinges, factor in a properly sized door closer. Norton and some other brands have heavy duty ones which can be adjusted for the operation speeds across different aspects of the closing cycle. not much worse than slamming your head or fingers in a 100Kg door...

#58

Thanks Jennifer, Glenn
Great material to work with

endorka wrote:Source of the post In the UK they have a rating based on weight of the door and expected use, which generally boils down to how often it will be opened and closed. I've never looked at the hinge material per se, other than to match it to surrounding decor. Perhaps there is something similar in Aus?

E.g 'Grade 13 door hinges comply with BS EN 1935, been tested to 200,000 cycles and can hold interior doors that weigh up to 120kg. These hinges have been fire-tested for an hour on timber doors.'

We seem to be big on the cycle count in specs down here but short on load bearing - but I might be able to cross reference with what you've given me.

gullfo wrote:Source of the post there are a variety of weight-size hinges though - so sometimes its desirable to go with lower rated and more hinges as means of keep the door edge straight(er)-to-seals, or cost (the heavy duty ones can run $300 or more each vs $40-50 for lighter ones).

beside the hinges, factor in a properly sized door closer. Norton and some other brands have heavy duty ones which can be adjusted for the operation speeds across different aspects of the closing cycle. not much worse than slamming your head or fingers in a 100Kg door...

No worries - I'm all over the heavy duty closers - that (and door seals) was what I was in the process of ordering when I thought about getting the hinges from the same supplier.
I quite like the idea of more hinges to keep the door straight...bit more rebating but who is going to complain about more detailed work when the whole job is detailed work

Andrew

#59

Hello team!

Just another random design thought while I was caulking..

I have 2 rooms in a room - 1 for "live", the other for "control"
All my calcs to date on isolation have been off a 115db source with a 40db objective 16m from my outer wall - so I'm trying to knock off around 60dB at 1 metre
So I'm building a "Room in Room" to the following specs:

outer room = 32mm of fyrchek (drywall) with green glue in the middle of the 2 sheets
inner rooms = 32mm of fyrchek (drywall) with green glue in the middle of the 2 sheets
gap of 180mm filled with fluffy

For the live room this makes sense - but why the same spec for the control room walls where the source will be 85dB - maybe 90?.

It occurred to me - why not drop the wall specs for the control room to reflect the lower isolation needs?

What am I missing?

Andrew

#60

so this will be two boundaries within a space? or the outer boundary will be the outside of both spaces? do 60db drop can be challenging - if you're using the NRC type ratings -- keep in mind those are assemblies which have measured results down to 125hz.

one thing to consider - what are you isolating from? or to? exterior noise getting in? or interior sound getting out?

on the question of the walls - if your live room and control room are sharing the same boundary gap to the exterior, then having the two walls (interior) be different isolation means - a) you sound from the control room can leak into the live room interfering with the recording, since more sound is exiting the CR, b) more live room sound in entering the CR and potentially interfering with the monitoring during recording.

if you have separate isolation walls exterior and a final constrained outer boundary (basically two rooms within a room abutting) then you have potential 3rd leaf issues.

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